Whether you use wall or floor tile, that tile needs to thoroughly stick to its base surface. Schluter-DITRA family of uncoupling membranes: Completely fill the cavities in the membrane. Using an appropriate sized notched trowel, comb additional mortar using the notched side of the trowel. The stuff I used was from HD and measured to the instructions. SpeedSet Fortified Thin-Set Mortar - CUSTOM Building Products. We and our partners use cookies to Store and/or access information on a device. box of un-sanded grout. And sometimes the type of tile itself is a determining factor. a. ANSI A118.1 is the American National Standard What is the difference between grey and white mortar? << /Type /Outlines /Count 0 >> Consult the stone Can Schluter mortars be used with resin-backed tiles? >> This full line of flooring prep products incorporates the most advanced technologies available. /Parent 3 0 R Proper installation results in full contact between the fleece webbing and the mortar. The notched trowel you use is dependent upon the overall size of the tile youre installing. Find some existing tutorials and project documentation videos to learn how-to get the best out of our products - for more fun in your life, start now! 4 0 obj This can be a deficit because it provides only a short window of time to make changes. For more sizes, use the material calculator at CustomBuildingProducts.com or contact CUSTOM Technical Services at 800-282-8786. Its a product that can cause skin irritation. Total Cost. We respect your email privacy. Mix the grout by hand mixing, or low-speed drill. Another advantage of thinset is that it allows you to level uneven surfaces to some degree. /F1 8 0 R When using DITRA-ROLLER, place a weight (e.g., bag(s) of mortar/grout or box of tile) not to exceed 75 lbs (34 kg) on the DITRA-ROLLER shelf. When you decide to use these thinset mortars to install wall or floor tile, the biggest benefit is the tile will bond permanently to the floor or the wall if you just do a few simple things. No, after the mortar is initially mixed no water or powder should be added. The TCNA says modified in their installation handbook and with my experience modified is best for tiles and that's how I do it, but I am looking for a better way of cutting the setup time of modified thinset on top of a vapor barrier type product. /CreationDate (D:20230501134756+00'00') An example of data being processed may be a unique identifier stored in a cookie. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Relative to thinset, epoxy mortar sets quickly, allowing you to get to the grouting of the tile within just a couple of hours. It is obvious that there is a large concern about getting air to your thinset. /I9 24 0 R I believe Grani-Rapid by Mapei achieves its full strength faster than either the TEC or Custom. ), the Schluter-Shower System, and KERDI-BOARD. Clean Up Products Hardware SpeedSet Fortified Thinset Powdered Mortar. >> 3. Epoxy tile mortar comes in two or three separate components that must be mixed by the user right before use. No. The last time I used premixed. I would personally never use them and for tile that large I would give it 3-4 days. Its quick-curing properties allow for grouting in as little as 3 hours and light traffic in 4 hours. to set and gain strength Can Schluter ALL-SET and Schluter FAST-SET modified thin-set mortars be used to set tile over Schluter boards and membranes? But if you mix too much, you can't "un-mix" it. How can I control PNP and NPN transistors together from one pin? Cures rapidly to allow grouting within 2 hours and traffic within 6 hours. Related documentation Technical Data Sheet Download Sustainability Product Report Download Volatile Organic Compound Download Extended cure times before and after grout application may be required if temperatures are lower. Notch size and configuration allow a specific amount of mortar to What should the consistency of the mortar be to set Schluter membranes (e.g., KERDI, DITRA, DITRA-HEAT) compared to the consistency of the mortar for setting tile? I am installing larger format Porcelain Tile (18"x18") over ditra on a plywood subfloor. Installation can be made on a damp surface, but new concrete must cure for at least 28 days before adhering the tile. So do you have any rough data on dry times with mortar? You should be fine to do indoor jobs in any weather as long as you're working in a climate-controlled space. 4. I do not want to use unmodified thinset like they recommend. How do I improve the slope of my mud bed and make it smoother for final tile layer? Mastic can give off a sharp, strong odor that takes time to dissipate. Can I use Schluter mortars to bond to a gypsum concrete substrate? Many houses on Long Island have ceramic tile that was installed by master craftsmen decades ago using a cement mortar thats 100-percent waterproof. Its quick-curing properties allow for grouting in as little as 3 hours and light traffic in 4 hours. Now, what about the drying times. Clean all excess mortar from tile and joints while mortar is still plastic using a sponge and clean water. >> Can small batches be mixed instead of mixing full bags of mortar for small areas? New Customers (301) 273-1995 Existing Customers (301) 205-5570. What Is the Ratio of Water to Mortar for Thinset Tile Installation? So that answers that will work. Make sure to observe the open time of the thin-set mortar. Due to the difficulty in mixing and working with epoxy mortars, they tend to be used by professional tile installers more than by do-it-yourselfers. It comes as powder that you mix with water to activate the bonding material, which is usually Portland cement. These membranes help to prevent cracks in the finished tile. Why do some of the Schluter mortars have more than one standard on the packaging? Temperatures must range between 60 and 90 F for proper installation. All Schluter mortars can be used to set large format and heavy tiles. For outdoor jobs, it's best to only apply thinset when it's between 40 and 95 degrees Fahrenheit. Be especially careful not to use hot water or hot mortar. If you are dealing with multiple spaces, then you may want to consider a dry mix to save money. For concrete substrates, remove any waxy or oily films and curing compounds (if present) by mechanical scarification (take steps to not to breath in any residual dust). Step Three: Only mix as much thinset mortar as you can cover with tile in about 15-20 minutes for the best results. - Ed Beal Mar 2, 2017 at 19:55 Thanks! Embedded hyperlinks in a thesis or research paper, "Signpost" puzzle from Tatham's collection. I can say that if you mix it in a plastic container that it will set up quicker than if you used a metal container. Thanks again for the insight! /I5 16 0 R Spread the mortar on a dry substrate. ] 22 0 R Get daily tips and tricks for making your best home. That's why you dial in the proper consistency while mixing at the first stage. A quick-setting, polymer-modified mortar, excellent for commercial use and cold temperature installations, as well as small residential jobs and repairs. If you would like to change your settings or withdraw consent at any time, the link to do so is in our privacy policy accessible from our home page.. Can be used for small repairs. Developing our own Why would Schluters modified thin-set be ok to use, but not other manufacturers modified thin-set? Mechanical strength is strong, so they hold the tile firmly in place and resist compression. endobj Excellent for commercial use and cold temperature installations, as well as small residential jobs and repairs. I would venture to say 30-45 minutes. << Step Seven: As you install tile, avoid excess thinset from squeezing up in between tiles. Thinset mortar is your default tile mortar for most indoor and outdoor applications. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. 3. If applying to a floor, consider using a crack-isolation membrane. CustomTech from Custom Building Products -- the brand flooring contractors have trusted since 1964. Its a good idea to use this if youre using white grout between the finished tiles. 16 years ago According to their literature: "Material in bucket will remain workable in excess of two hours." By Laura Gaskill Put your rooms head and shoulders above the rest with portraits styled in unexpected ways DECORATING GUIDES By Scheer & Co. Wipe surfaces with a damp sponge to remove dust and dirt just before applying the thinset. Product composed of a proprietary blend of Portland cement, inorganic aggregates, copolymers and chemicals. Can be used for small repairs. SpeedSet Fortified Thin-Set Mortar is a strong polymer-modified mortar that sets quickly for time critical installations. Install grout per ANSI A108.10, A108.9 or A108.6 specifications and grout manufacturers instructions. Thinset is a mortar that is made of Portland cement, silica sand, and moisture-retaining agents. I have used accelerators for thinset before and have had mixed results. Here's what you need to know, Yes, you can have a new build youll love right off the bat. /Length 3675 >> Mortar ridges should run in one direction. Thinset tile mortar provides a very strong bond and is resistant to moisture and mold growth. /I3 12 0 R Schluter-DITRA family of uncoupling membranes: Solidly embed into the mortar using a float, screed trowel, or SchluterR-DITRA-ROLLER. To view the purposes they believe they have legitimate interest for, or to object to this data processing use the vendor list link below. Epoxy mortars are resistant to a wide variety of chemicals. Pkg Specs. Schluter mortars can be used over gypsum substrates. Pot life for most epoxy tile mortars is about 45 minutes. 3 0 obj Manufacturer Custom Building Products Technical Services 10400 Pioneer Boulevard, Unit 3 Santa Fe Springs, CA 90670 Customer Support: 800-272-8786 Technical Services: 800-282-8786 Fax: 800- 200-7765 Email: contactus@cbpmail.net custombuildingproducts . In most cases, the tile applicationwhere the tile is installedclearly determines the best mortar option. ?X~ wAb%St}.PS2uzvzzfWdM*7Y*H%6Wo\,9]f1~q4fyC6[sfS|s7mee67kUB"//Sgpz7ozEVxtysjw]:fth76vdvk>|hSq`nPw}ym*L!Ag kSZ{]e>lXd+S'YIOE'nw_MlNhPqO>^s`8r)nq9ny V +^}F~pN. Mortar ridges should run in one direction. Manufacturers often recommend allowing a window of 24 to 48 hours for curing time, and in this case, longer is better. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. It will increase the tile's longevity and durability. How much thin-set do I need to install tile over DITRA or DITRA-HEAT? When backbuttering, consider the tile underside pattern and depth to estimate thickness and usage to add to your estimate. Thin-set mortar is less likely to crack if it dries slowly, but if you need it to dry more quickly to avoid damage to it, you can speed up the process. Grout in as little as 3 hours. /MediaBox [0.000 0.000 595.280 841.890] Can I use more sand topping mortar to level the slope of a shower pan? endobj For installation of tile, use 5.5 - 6.5 qts (5.2 - 6.2 L) of water to 50 lbs (22.7 kg) of mortar. The mixture shrinks and hardens as it dries. 18 0 R How to Work with Schluter Thin-Set Mortars, Schluter-Systems: Position on Thin-set Mortar. This will have the same effect on the evaporation rate as heat. Hunker may earn compensation through affiliate links in this story. Please contact your Schluter representative or Customer Support at 800-472-4588 regarding the What type of thin-set should I use in an exterior application? Privacy Policy, SpeedSet Fortified Thinset Powdered Mortar. Follow gypsum manufacturers directions for additional substrate preparation. Materials must be acclimated to ambient conditions and installed when the ambient and surface temperatures are within a range of 40F (4C) to 95F (35C). Large format tiles is a big trend here and a constant issue. You can access a handy quick start guide with more tips and a full tool list here: Thinset Quick Start Guide. Mastic vs Thinset for Backsplash /I7 20 0 R Warmer temperatures speed up curing time; cooler temperatures slow it down. >> White thinset is used with white or very light-colored stone or tile. Notched trowels are metering devices. And stir it occasionally by hand with a margin trowel. Clean all excess mortar from tile and joints while mortar is still plastic using a sponge and clean water. << /Type /Page > Products > Setting > Rapid Setting Mortars > SpeedSet Fortified Thin-Set Mortar. Some types of thinset also have polymers or other ingredients added to help make the thinset more workable and stronger. For the conventional two-step process of thin-setting and grouting, use Glass Tile Adhesive Mortar, 254 Platinum (white), or 257 Titanium (white). /Producer ( d o m p d f + C P D F) Thinset takes a long time to dry which makes it possible for vertically mounted tiles to sag during this period. It must be easy to work with, and it must adequately fill in gaps between the tile and the substrate. 2. Otherwise, it can reduce the strength of the thinset mortar. What were the most popular text editors for MS-DOS in the 1980s? The mortar begins setting once it is mixed, so you have to use up the entire batch or discard any excess. The working time of the mixture can vary, considering several things. Should one use modified thinset when using a waterproof membrane like Redguard? Working time is how long you have to get the tile in it's final position before you mess up the bond. Perceive the process and learn 6 useful beginner tips. Now, what about the drying times. Wear high-quality kneepads or kneel on a very soft rubber gardening or similar cushion. Additionally, the moisture will not be drawn out of the thin set mortar as quickly. You may need to allow this fast-setting thinset to cure for four to six hours before walking on it. Curing and GroutingMaintain ambient and surface temperatures between 40F to 95F (4 C to 35 C). I think your concrete accelerator will work - as far as drying faster. The thinset mortar should have a consistency of warm cake icing. Epoxy-based mortars have high compressive strength and stick well to resin-backed stones. But unless you buy a fast-setting formula, plan to stay off drying thinset for at least a few days. By creating an account you agree to the Hunker. Upper Marlboro, MD 20774, Washington D.C. Application. Solidly embed the tile in the mortar, pushing the tile in a back and forth motion to collapse the mortar ridges. How to combine several legends in one frame? Hunker may earn compensation through affiliate links in this story. First time mixing up thinset from the bag. endobj I understand that there is an issue overall but that's part of the job. All Schluter mortars are suitable for use in wet areas. /ProcSet 4 0 R 2. 2 0 obj So that answers that will work. Ah yes, saw that in the title and I fixed that thank you! Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. Thin-set mortar is a suitable substrate for laying ceramic tile. Working time, pot life, etc. Application To substrate: Send us an email: , Thin-Set Mortar One-Year Limited Warranty, Lifetime Thin-Set System Extended Limited Warranty, Using a Prefabricated Shower Tray and Ramp, Engineered for use both under and over all DITRA and KERDI products, Ready to grout in 4 hours for fast-track projects, Suitable for use with ceramic, porcelain, and stone tile, including large and heavy tile, Meets ANSI A118.4TF, ANSI A118.11, & ANSI A118.15TF, Lifetime warranty when used with applicable Schluter. Light traffic in 4 hours. With most kinds of thinset, it's generally advisable to wait at least 48 hours after application before walking on or applying pressure to the tile. b. Schluter-KERDI family of waterproofing membranes: Solidly embed into the mortar using the flat side of the trowel or a drywall finishing knife and work the membrane onto the entire surface to ensure full coverage and remove air pockets. 5 0 obj Using an appropriate sized notched trowel, comb additional mortar using the notched side of the trowel. Some manufacturers make polymer-fortified thinset mortar that's designed to cure in as few as two to three hours, allowing for a one-day tiling and grouting job. Posts: 432. Continue mixing for 2-3 minutes until the mortar consistency is smooth and lump-free. Counting and finding real solutions of an equation. Be sure the surface youre applying the thinset to is clean, dust-free and in very good condition. I know that the setup time will depend on the tile size but do you think it will set up in about 12 hours with an 18"x18" tile? In addition to the nature of your job and the type of thinset you use, temperature plays a major role in determining how long it takes for thinset mortar to fully cure. Someone may have a better answer than mine but they would have to have tested specific products and ratios and give you their experience - not thinking you will get that but who knows. We and our partners use data for Personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. Disadvantages of Using Thinset for Backsplash. Accelerators do work I use them especially when doing outdoor work in cold weather. Products | Resources | Interactive Tools | Warranties | Privacy Policy | TechnicalTraining, Waterproofing Membranes And Underlayments, Longest side of tile less than 8" use 1/4" x 1/4" x 1/4" (6 x 6 x 6 mm) Square-Notch, Longest side of tile 8" to 15" use 1/4" x 3/8" x 1/4" (6 x 9.5 x 6 mm) Square-Notch. Receive access to helpful resources and ensure youre operating successfully long-term. You can still use a similar cement-based mortar to install your tile and its not that hard to do. Any leveling or sloping of the assembly must be done Thin-set mortar is not considered a wear surface, therefore is not suitable for use as a grout. Could these ideas work for your home today? The key is predictability. [/PDF /Text /ImageC ] Thinset or mortar (or thinset mortar, thinset cement, dryset mortar, or drybond mortar) is an adhesive made of cement, fine sand, and a water retaining agent such as an alkyl derivative of cellulose. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. I have been told that a fan will also help but have not ever tried this because I was afraid it would cause more problems. However, the Schluter-Shower System details Can Schluter mortars be used with moisture-sensitive stone? Resin-backed tiles may require special setting materials. What is the shelf life of Schluter thin-set mortars? It only takes a minute to sign up. The damp surface also helps to increase the bond, especially in hot, dry weather. Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! But it will work with modified thinset? This is why following package directions for your specific type of thinset is so important. Be sure to add the grout to water slowly. This cure time will be longer if the temperature of the room is below 60 F. Summary: Be sure you read all instructions, including safety instructions when working with thinset mortar. To DITRA or KERDI products: /I1 10 0 R Excess or standing surface water must be removed prior to installation. I will continue with this and post my results after a while. For Un-sanded Grout: Add 2.5 pints of cool, potable water for each 10 lb. Schluter recommends mixing full batches with measured amounts of water to learn the correct How precise must the measuring of water used for mixing be? Certain moisture-sensitive stones (e.g., green marble) may require special setting materials. Cost/ft 2. Put clean, potable water into a clean pail. Fast setting, polymer modified mortar ideal for fast track or cold weather jobs. Which ability is most related to insanity: Wisdom, Charisma, Constitution, or Intelligence? Does it cut the time from 7 days to 3 or can it actually get down to 12 hours. Add water, apply and let the mortar cure for 6 hours. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? Often you must stay off the new tile floor 48 hours before starting to grout the floor. /Pages 3 0 R >> Interpreting non-statistically significant results: Do we have "no evidence" or "insufficient evidence" to reject the null? By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. Wipe surfaces with a damp sponge to remove dust and dirt just before applying the thinset. Step Six: Working with thinset on floors is very hard on your knees. Recommended Tile Type Standard Mosaic Ceramic Porcelain Cement Natural Stone Quarry ANSI Specifications A118.4 A118.11 Set Speed Fast The thinset mortar should have a consistency of warm cake icing. 14 0 R Circulate the air around the mortar with a fan and keep the space ventilated to maximize air flow. Accelerators speed up the set but not the full cure time as they react with the cement part of the mix. >> Continuing Education for Architects & Designers. Also, using hot water makes it set faster than cold water. The thinset will get in the way of grout youll apply later. Can I use Kerdi Board instead of Cement Board to thinset natural stone tile? Back-buttering is a useful way to help ensure proper coverage, particularly when installing 12" x 12" (305 mm x 305 mm) and larger tiles. 2. This is also why I'm asking the question to see if there are more experiences out there with this specific situation. Lift up a corner of the membrane to check coverage. >> Any general rule for working time for modified thinset? endobj What Is the Ratio of Water to Mortar for Thinset Tile Installation. b. Schluter-KERDI family of waterproofing products: Apply a thin layer of the mortar with the flat side of the trowel to produce solid contact with the fleece. Ceramic Tile Advice Forums - John Bridge Ceramic Tile, 1st time tiler working with colorbody textured porcelain. Monitor the mortar and reduce the heat if you see signs of cracking. Schluter recommends making separate mixes for each process. Step Five: When setting tile into the thinset . Thanks! Great for commercial use and cold temperatures. Time to Step Out of Your Color Comfort Zone? Lift up a corner of the membrane to check coverage. (800) 394-0019, Richmond That information is included on the bag, or should be. /Font << Tile adhesive is expected to hold the tile in place not just for years but for decadeswithout fail. Guess what? Color: Gray. Consult the tile/stone supplier and Schluter No. Additionally, epoxy mortar sets quickly. In standard conditions (70F How soon can I grout when using FAST-SET. For installing Schluter membranes, use 7 8 qts (6.6 7.6 L) of water to 50 lbs (22.7 kg) of mortar. The point at which it is too stiff to realistically work anymore. Any moisture underneath the mortar will leach into the mixture and slow the drying time. It comes as powder that you mix with water to activate the bonding material, which is usually Portland cement. /MediaBox [0.000 0.000 595.280 841.890] Thin-set mortar has a variety of applications, including underlayment for tile, concrete repairs and decorative surfacing. Once the batch is mixed, it may start to harden so quickly that you can't spread it evenly. NEVER add more water to thinset thats getting hard in the bucket. Thinset tile mortar has a smooth, slippery consistency, similar to mud. The accelerator will decrease the time. By clicking Accept All Cookies, you agree to the storing of cookies on your device to enhance site navigation, analyze site usage, and assist in our marketing efforts. But I am risk adverse especially when the risk I am taking is mitigated by me doing "nothing" for a couple of days. Protect the installation from heavy traffic and water exposure for a minimum of 24 hours to allow the mortar to set. Clean all excess mortar from tile and joints while mortar is still plastic using a sponge and clean water. Temperatures must range between 60 and 90 F for proper installation. What are your thoughts? Manufacturers often recommend allowing a window of 24 to 48 hours for curing time, and in this case, longer is better. Some of our partners may process your data as a part of their legitimate business interest without asking for consent. Back buttering may be necessary. We havent changed our position on thin-set mortar use within our systems. Why in the Sierpiski Triangle is this set being used as the example for the OSC and not a more "natural"?
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